Product Genius, the Podcast for Inventors, Entrepreneurs, and Startups

Steven Julian: Have you ever caught yourself wondering about the comfort of your cat’s paws as they’re walking around your house? We may come up with an idea of that on today’s show, but more importantly, we talk about the world of patents and how much they are changing with Brock Kolls from Gr8BigIdeas. next on Product Genius. Do you want to be a successful inventor entrepreneur?
Brock Kolls: Struggling to get your product from idea to market? Well, you’ve come to the right place.
Steven: Welcome to Product Genius.
Brock Kolls: The down-to-earth podcast that explores important topics about inventing and launching new products.
Steven: Noah McNeely is your trusted guide. With more than 20 years of product launch experience, he’s here to help you on your journey to become a product genius.
Brock Kolls: Let’s get started. Here’s your slightly annoying co-host, Steven Julian.
Steven Julian: Hey, that’s my line. Yes, it is another, as I clear my throat. It’s an allergy-filled episode of Product Genius, so I will try to limit the times. I clear my throat. It is your slightly annoying co-host, Steven Julian. Why am I slightly annoying? Because I clear my throat on the air. I am seated all the way across the table. from the intrepid producer, Jody Smith, and I am seated next to two gentlemen. One you know, one you’ve heard before, and he’s in the studio again. The one you know is Noah McNeely. He is the Brain Trust.
Noah: Well, I appreciate the elevation.
Steven: Wow, he’s interrupting me.
Noah: Oh, I thought you were done. I’m sorry.
Steven: That was a dramatic pause.
Noah: Hey, clear your throat again. Yeah, well, I appreciate the elevation to gentlemen. I’ll take it.
Steven: Yes, you are. You are a fine gentleman. And you also associate with other fine gentlemen. One of them is in the studio with us. Brock Kolls is here from Gr8BigIdeas, GR, the numeral eight, bigideas.com. Brock, welcome back to the studio.
Brock Kolls: Great to be here.
Steven: Actually, not the studio. Welcome back to The Lair. It’s a Lair you know quite well because you and Noah have worked together.
Brock Kolls: That’s it. Yeah. I’m out to the lair every once in a while. Absolutely.
Steven: You were invited. The stay of execution was lifted, and we said, come on back. Actually, there’s more probation. The Gr8BigIdeas, for those that haven’t heard you in a past episode, first of all, listen to. this episode. Well, I guess they could pause and go back, but you’ve been on a couple of times. You even date back to when Tiffany was running the show. So for those that haven’t heard yet, tell everybody about Gr8BigIdeas and what you do.
Brock Kolls: So I focus on intellectual property. My background is an entrepreneur. I’ve had a successful startup, did work in corporate for a long period of time, did open innovation. I’ve seen intellectual property from a lot of different perspectives. My focus now is working out of an innovation lab here for about the last 10 years, just working with startups and entrepreneurs. I feel like it’s my kind of people. They have unique types of problems that they need to be very efficient and very fast. They had to be very budget conscious. They had to be very successful. And so I love it. I’ve worked out of Atlanta Tech Park now for 10 years, which is a great place. I’ve known Noah for a very long time, even before that. I did some work when I was with Coca-Cola.
Noah: And I’ll be honest, I’m too old to even remember when we met, but I just know at some point in the past we met and you started Gr8BigIdeas and reached back out and then… Yeah. We’ve regrown the relationship.
Steven: And Noah, I think one of the things that comes across if people have listened to past episodes or they’ll pick it up very quickly, I think you and Brock make a great pair because you both come at trying to help the product developer, the entrepreneur, the inventor, and you’re trying to help without wasting time or money.
Noah: Yeah, I think that’s a fair statement and a good statement. I think both Brock and I, you know, we’re not in this necessarily just to make all the money we can. We’re in this to help people. And at least my philosophy, and I think I can speak for Brock, is you do that and you’re going to have plenty of clients that want to pay you to do stuff.
Steven: So when a friend comes by and he’s been on the show a couple times already, one of the things that happens is Jody and I walk into the lair. On our show call time. And Brock and Noah are deep. in a conversation that for all I know was either going on for five minutes or five hours. I have no idea. They’re having a great time. They’re talking. And it kept Noah from sending out the pre-show email that he normally sends out. Hey, here’s what I’m thinking. So I’m listening to this great conversation. I’m just listening for my name. I have no, I mean, it’s way over my head as they’re talking about patents and provisionals and things like that. And then I finally get to go, okay, so what are we doing? And they both just look at me like, well, let’s talk about patents. Let’s talk about what Brock’s doing. Let’s talk about this new thing that’s happening. And it’s going to be another show about AI. So we’re just going to have a conversation. We have no idea where this is going to go. Slightly annoying. co-hosts love that because I’m just going to listen for.
Noah McNeely: In fact, Brock’s idea for this show… Inspire my thoughts for the next show. We’ll get to that later.
Steven: So it was a five-hour conversation. It was. All right. I apologize for the two-minute rant.
Noah: It’s been a. two-month conversation.
Steven: It’s been great. Okay. Brock, there are some massive things happening on gr8bigideas.com and some changes that have happened to your business. So let me just ask, before you talk about what’s happening now, let’s go back a year, two years ago. What was the typical process like when you would work with an entrepreneur?
Brock Kolls: So ever since the beginning, I’ve always offered somebody to be able to come to the website and pick a time to talk. And that continues. Anybody can come to the Gr8BigIdeas website. My calendar’s on there and they can click. A lot of times when I get referrals from Noah and everything, it’s the email I send out. Hey, I’d love to talk to you. Glad to hear about your idea. I’d love to talk about patents, maybe share the process with you. A lot of times we’d just… Non-confidential conversation, but they can pick a time that works and we have that conversation. So that hasn’t changed and I don’t see that changing. I think it’s great. And then once I speak to them, suddenly they’re into text messages and emails all the time. It feels like I have. a permanent friend on there. And I think it’s great. I would deduce myself as an entrepreneur and a patent person as well. The journey for an entrepreneur is very up and down. It’s long. A lot of times they need to check in, get a checkup, and that type of thing. So I’m available for that all the time. Early in the process, we talk about provisional patents just because they’re mostly inexpensive and you don’t have to have all the details. And it does give you a patent pending status. for a lot of people. They want to raise money or talk to manufacturers. They want to feel like they have their idea. Protected. And so it’s a good early first step.
Steven Julian: So what has not changed is your basic business. You still want to offer, first of all, a free, no pressure conversation for anyone who’s in that journey, starting that journey, looking at that journey. But then your business model is if you want someone who’s been around a lot of patents, helped with a lot of patents, kind of be a… I hate the word consultant, but just a partner on the journey to just. kind of, you’ve walked through the minefield a few times, and so you’re helping people with that. So that hasn’t changed.
Brock Kolls: That hasn’t changed. Drafting, prosecuting patents, that’s the bread and butter.
Steven: That’s the bread and butter of your business.
Brock Kolls: I’m super successful at it. I’ve got about a 96% success rate with the patent office, and I attribute a lot of that to being able to just take as much time as it takes. To work on somebody’s idea to get it done right.
Steven: And much like Noah, because Noah’s had a couple shows where we’ve talked about there are other companies that, in the strictest sense of the term, technically kind of do what Noah does, but their difference is they’re just trying to take money from people. That’s my words, not his. Although it might be his intonation at times.
Noah: I insinuate a lot of things without legally crossing any boundaries.
Steven: Yes, you do. That’s what makes you a genius.
Noah: If anyone needs Steven’s contact information, let me know.
Steven: If in the world of designing patents, filing patents, there’s some of that going on too outside of your business, which sets your business apart, correct?
Brock Kolls: Yeah. So. maybe one of my big set of parts is I don’t charge by the hour rate. And I can just work on things as long as it takes to do it right. I think it’s a huge difference.
Steven Julian: Transparent pricing is a huge thing.
Brock Kolls: Just a flat fee for everything. I think part of the process, too, is to get off on the right foot. A lot of times you’ll meet somebody who’s maybe spent too much money too fast. Guiding principle should be that your patent budget should never be bigger than your project budget on there. And so getting a provisional patent done. Or getting a landscape search report done shouldn’t be a super hard budget decision because both of those help give you very good data points. One sort of validates whether you’re on the right track. The other one maybe helps you make some product development decisions on there. And so easy on-ramp, no sharp edges. Is a great way to start. And the provisional then gives you plenty of runway to sort out what your real idea is. Still see if you’re passionate about it in six months. If you’re ready for commercialization or not, sometimes life happens and it slows people down.
Steven: So as we’re recording this in near the middle of 2026, now there’s been this new… Toy that you’re excited about on your website. So talk about it.
Brock Kolls: Well, you know, so each year I try to find a way to scale myself.
Steven: Oh, you are such an entrepreneur at heart.
Brock Kolls: You know, much of the business, which is reading, writing, editing, reading, writing, editing, reading, writing, editing, right? And then comes along AI. And AI really helps, right? Not only in analyzing, but, you know, orchestrating, composing, and that type of stuff. So, you know, starting maybe a year and a half ago, I started using AI as a tool, you know, to really analyze patents. And it was fantastic. Now, I think it’s grown up to the point where… With the right kind of coaching, the right kind of input, it can really author some fantastic documents. And in the context of a provisional application, frankly, it can just do much more of a thorough job than you would be willing to pay somebody to do. Because, you know, there’s a price you pay and a value you get. Provisionals. are supposed to be inexpensive. And so starting about the last quarter of last year, I began offering on my website being able to come. Put in a credit card, buy a project ID, and get an automated, paste in your invention idea and get an automated provisional application. And it’s been fantastic. It not only has lowered the cost even below what I was charging before, but it delivers it to your inbox in about 15 minutes. And then we work on it together. A lot of times inventors will have figures they want to add, but they can go through and it’s more of kind of fine tuning a document than authoring a document. And a lot of times we can get it done in a day or two and filed and they’ve got a patent pending status on their idea. Lickety split.
Steven: Before you were doing this, how long would it take for you to do a provisional patent for someone time-wide? Let’s just talk time-wide.
Brock Kolls: Correct. So, you know what, I have to mix it in with the other work that I do, right?
Steven: You have to find time.
Noah: Do you mean you don’t do one? client at a time? Yeah, I don’t either. And that creates similar issues.
Brock Kolls: So a lot of the work takes a lot of time and you need to like a record, you need to kind of start a track and you need to finish a track before you’re on there. And so a lot of times I have to tell them, hey, man, it’s taking two or three weeks to get to it. And then you’re sort of asking them, you know, what is the invention? You know, provide me some details. And what I’d usually get is maybe two or three sentences in an email. Right. And so it leaves a lot to be figured out on there. What’s unique about the AI tool is that you can take very few facts about somebody’s invention and you can amplify those into a really great invention disclosure. You can begin to articulate what type of problem is it solving and how it would go about doing that. You can ask it to think about all the different ways it could be done and take a look at patent archives to see who’s done that type of stuff and try to… Create a narrative on how this idea is different in there, how it might fit in and be unique, and then tell it to use that information. To create this fantastic provisional application, I was telling Noah, these things are exhaustive. They’re like 30, 40, 50, 60 pages out there, 60, 70 claims. It’s every single version of how it can be done. It can be a kit and it can be this and it can be that. Those types of level of details is something that you couldn’t pay somebody by the hour to do. And you certainly couldn’t get a cheap provisional written by somebody for. But as a starting document. It is fantastic. And it immediately puts it in front of the inventor who can go through and say, okay, it’s great. I added one thing. I took this out. I added this other thing. I have four or five photographs of my prototype I’d like to put in. And bingo, we have a sensational application in very little time. Hours.
Steven: Instead of weeks.
Noah: And for those people who aren’t AI savvy, how is this different than just going and… Saying, hey, ChatGPT, write me a patent.
Steven: Yeah.
Brock Kolls: So what’s unique about it is I have a particular style of how I like to put applications together. And so the tool is trained in order to write in the same style that I do on how the applications are organized. I mean, there’s a couple of things that I think are really important. A lot of people come to me for provisional applications because they want to raise money. And so those provisional applications have to look. Like non-provisional applications, they have to read and pass the test that an investor would put under scrutiny on those. And so I organize that content and I author those patents in a certain way so that those people feel comfortable putting a document in front of those types of people. And have them look at that and say, that’s a fantastic idea. It’s fully here. Remember, a patent pending on an idea that’s not there doesn’t mean anything on there.
Noah: But we protected a way to do it. that can’t be done.
Brock Kolls: Brilliant. Yeah, that’s right. Or you see, it’s like a form somebody’s filled out. What’s the main idea? How does it help people? And there’s four or. five sentences on there and people say, well, I have a… I have a pending patent on my idea, right? That’s a lot different than somebody looking at how it works and how it goes together.
Noah: And I think you and I were talking earlier, there’s another service, I don’t know if you want to name them by name, that charges about the same. That you charge for this, and it’s just that form, basically.
Brock Kolls: It’s just a form. And I see it all the time, but people feel great about it. They’re like, hey, I have an application. My deadline’s coming up. Can you help me do a non-provisional? Oh, great. Send me your provisional application. Let me take a look at it. And it looks like something that came off a ditto machine from the 70s with eight lines of text on it, right? What’s your market? Who would it help? Everyone.
Steven: Yeah.
Brock Kolls: That’s exactly.
Steven: More vegan options.
Noah: Everyone would buy it if they could.
Steven: Right.
Brock Kolls: So, you know, with a provisional application, you know, what really makes it unique amongst other types of applications like non-provisionals is that there’s no particular format or style. So the patent. office will take everything. And since there’s no, like, scrutiny as to what the composition of it would be. A napkin would be accepted, right, by the patent office, but clearly you need more than a napkin to get a patent.
Noah: So there’s a lot of just crap out there that has provisional patent labeled on top of it.
Steven: Well, what people are getting with this AI tool is Brock’s experience because Brock has taught the tool to write in a way that historically over time… Has been 96% successful.
Brock Kolls: It not only writes in my way, but I’m on the back end. Yes. Because I’ve talked to people, they’ve used the tool, and now we’re talking about how to fine-tune this document. Yeah. And I file it for them, right? So we’re on the journey together. It’s like you get all the benefits of having that person. You just get the efficiency, speed, and cost savings of getting that document done faster and more thorough than a human would do.
Steven: And to be clear. And what you want to come out of this, if someone just did the tool, okay, they get the document. It’s way better than the. eight lines of text from the Ditto machine. But the other thing they could get is a little bit of consultation with you, a little bit of backend human interaction of, let me look at what it produced. And okay, I would change the, and the inventor themselves and you can then bring your experience to bear and go, this is great. I would take this out. I would add this. Now they’re getting. They’re getting that help to just make the document even better.
Brock Kolls: Even better. And, you know, we even take it one step further. You know, I mentioned I have a landscaping tool the same way. A lot of times I’ll take… Stop.
Steven: What is a landscaping tool in the world of pet?
Noah: It’s not a hedge term.
Steven: I know it’s not. Well, it is in a different…
Noah: We’ll create an analog.
Steven: So I apologize for talking over the guests, but you said it a couple of times and I’m like, I have to stop. What is a landscape search report?
Brock Kolls: So a landscape search report is not taking an idea and not only going and searching to see what prior patents have been done on it, but also take a look at what products are in the marketplace. And then presenting an analysis on there based on your idea. Here’s what I see. Here’s what I don’t see. If you’re developing a product, here are the features I might steer towards. Here are the ones I’d stay away from. So a lot of times what we’ll do is we’ll run, we’ll do a provisional, and then I’ll take the whole provisional application and run it through the landscape tool. And now they’ve got a great… Double whammy, right? They’ve got an application and they’ve got this great landscape to show what sort of patents are out there, what sort of products might be in the marketplace, strategies on how we might do future patents and product development, maybe guidance on features that might be good to go after or features to avoid. On there, for example, I’ve seen things say like… You know, lots of people use this type of fastener on here. There’s really no sort of unique thing about this. But if you use this other type of fastener on here, or if this was foldable, or if this was, you know, separable, and these were two different things, or if this could be organized in a kit, hey, those are all really great space areas on there.

Steven: So, hold on.

Noah: Okay.

Steven: I’ve got a question for you.

Noah: Do I need to take a number?

Steven: No. Survey number seven. Oh, that’s me. Okay. Hang on to your question. I have a question for you, though, Noah. Okay. As the person who works with the inventor entrepreneur to get their product to market, to do a prototype, to, you know, we’ve talked about all those things on this show. What’s your interaction with the provisional patent? What’s your interaction with the landscape report? How does this help? If someone came to you and said, hey, I had this idea. I ran it through this tool. I heard it on Brox. Now I’m coming to you. Do they come to you first or does it help if they come to you after they’ve already done this?

Noah: I would say yes and both.

Steven: Great. You are such a lawyer.

Noah: Yes, both. And this sentence does not apply.

Steven: It depends.

Noah: This page intentionally left blank. So sometimes before they do the provisional patent. Someone might brainstorm with me, okay, what are some other ways we can do, or they may not come to brainstorm with me, but I’m going to sit down at the table with them, look at what they’re trying to do. Okay, you’re solving this problem. Let’s brainstorm other ways to do it. And then they’ll take that and they’ll put it in Brock’s system or give it to Brock on a phone call or whatever. That can help expand. Flip that the other way, they might go through Brock’s system first, and it’s going to identify a lot of embodiments that I wouldn’t naturally think of. Now, it’s AI, so some of them are not going to be particularly useful, but a lot of them are. Some of them are going to be probably unbuildable in the real world. Doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be in the patent, though, because who knows what technology will be out in five years. But so it kind of goes back and forth.

Steven: Serving question seven. now, that’s on you.

Noah: It was really more than- Eight, eight.

Steven: Serving question eight. I was seven, sorry. It’s not- Number seven, I mean eight.

Noah: It’s not a question. It’s really more of. an analogy. And I would say what I was thinking about as you were describing this is this analogy, anyone can go out and buy- A really high-end set of woodworking tools and they can cut a piece of lumber with it. But you put those same tools in the hands of a master woodworker and they can build you a top-notch kitchen. You’re the master woodworker and AI is sort of the set of tools here. And I think that’s the difference between someone going and just doing it themselves and working with you.

Brock Kolls: It’s not like random AI either, like we were talking about. I was going to ask him. I feel like I’m a coach. And you’ve trained a tool to do something specific. And it is highly optimized for this output on there. And it understands not only the inventor who’s putting their idea in, but it knows what kind of ideas that it gets. And it understands how to amplify them, right? And it can then parse those ideas and really build a great application around it. It’s not random. And it comes out in a fantastic format. that is exactly what you would want. if you had an unlimited budget. And because it’s in a provisional format. It’s a nice way to go after everything. It could do this. It could do the other thing. It could do those things. It could do this, that, and the other. It’s the whole kitchen sink mentality in that provisional because you just don’t know what kind of products you’re going to get, like what you were saying, on the end, right? What’s manufacturable? What’s designed for manufacturing? You know, what works? What’s cost-efficient? Those things all work themselves out as you go down the product development cycle on there. You hope you have some sort of, you know, teetering on those things inside a document like that. Product Genius is brought to you by Opu Probiotics. Pre and probiotics you can pour directly on your tongue in delicious mint and mocha flavors. But the taste is just the beginning. With Opu, you can see improved digestive function, boosted immune system, easier weight management, improved mental health, and much more. Try today at GetOpu.com. That’s GetOpu.com.

Steven Julian: Well, let’s be clear, too. If someone who does not have your experience, someone who is a slightly annoying co-host came. out of this show and said, I’m going to offer something like Brock offers to people, and they just went to—or an inventor who said, I don’t need Brock. I’m going to go to ChatGPT and say, oh, write me a provisional patent. If they go to an open AI source that hasn’t been coached properly, that hasn’t been tweaked, and that doesn’t have the back end of—Your files and your work, then it’s going to just be fluff.

Noah: Well, they could also ask ChatGPT, how do I perform an appendectomy on myself? And it’ll go, great question.

Steven: No, it won’t. It’ll say, great question. You can do it if you set your mind to it. Get a scalpel, cut across your belly.

Noah: I don’t think ChatGPT would answer. I think Grok would answer that. Grok will answer anything.

Brock Kolls: You know, there’s a lot that goes into these applications in the way you describe it. Describing it in a very non-limiting way, right? Or putting together claims in a correct format that those types of things, just a simple question on AI doesn’t get right all the time. You want this, I say patent applications are part art and. part science. You really want this relationship between how you describe your invention and the claims and how you then expand that description. Through the application, you want it to be really tight. You want to pick descriptive terms for all the parts of your invention that aren’t necessarily super common. And you want to be able to give a great set of definitions for everything that the patent office might say, well, you know, I wonder I could use my definition and I could say no to something like this. And so there’s a lot that goes into putting together a really great application. And it’s tough for anybody in the provisional realm to try to do a superset of somebody’s idea on a microscopic budget. And so this tool solves that problem. And then behind the scenes, getting those applications filed isn’t necessarily a slam dunk. For instance, A lot of people want them assigned to their companies or they have special filing requirements that go with it. And you really need somebody to take the time to get the paperwork filled out correctly and submitted. There’s three or four different types of. Filing fees that need to. be paid. And if you pay the wrong fee or don’t pay the fee, then your application goes abandoned. I worked on one this week, right, where somebody believed through the whole year, the one that they had filed was ready to go. And then I take a look at it and they never really finished paying the fee because they picked one status and paid for another. And the application went abandoned. And so you need somebody to not only take a look at what the output is and see how it is, but then to take your figures and get it in and get it feathered all together and then get the right forms filled out, get the thing filed. I also put it in a tracking system, docketing system. Sends out reminders that are on there. Hey, man, six months, I’m checking in. Ten months, hey, where are you with the project? Are we going to be doing non-provisional? Now’s the time to get this done. Hey, we got one month to go. If we’re really going to do it, we got to turn up the heat and get it done. And so a lot of the. timings that go on that get missed on there that people end up falling short on their connecting.

Steven: I’m very tempted to ask where you think this tool and the next step of these tools, but I’m not going to ask that. What I would like to ask instead is, can you go back to when you first started thinking about setting this up and coaching and training? What were some of the pre-steps or first steps? Without giving away the secret recipe, what were some of the things you did first? What was the first like, okay, as I get down this AI thing? I, you know, it didn’t just start with, I’m going to make this tool. I think there was a, I think there was a journey you went on. Can you take us back to the beginning of that? And what were some of the first things you were doing? that, that made you go, hmm, interesting. This might lead to something else. Yeah.

Brock Kolls: So I worked with an inventor on different, different subject matter who had taken the time to automate a report, an industry report. And it used to take a lot of time. to do analysis. And I was fascinated by it, right? And Noah and I, we’ve talked about some of the tools out there to do different types of automations and that type of thing. This is all relatively new. And so I thought I would experiment with it. I already had the steps that I went through to do a provisional application and how I was using AI to enhance each one of those steps. So I theoretically had the sequence, right? I just took the time to organize it through an automated tool. And I did an example once I had it up there. I said, hey, my invention is slippers for cats. You know, just one. You know, one sentence, right? And it came back and it said, whoa, great. Here’s, you know, an 18 page description on this whole thing. And it’s filled out in a 75 page application on slippers for cats. And I said, this is fantastic. I mean, this, I’ve got something here. I think that this can really help people who have raw ideas that want to generate a sensational application, lickety split. It’s fantastic. And because I just work with the output. instead of having to create the document and everything, you can pass along those savings. It makes it a no brainer.

Steven: To be clear, the great idea was the new AI tool, not slippers for cats. He’s still working on that.

Brock Kolls: I got Noah working on it. Yeah, exactly.

Noah McNeely: That’s why all the cats are chained up in the back.

Brock Kolls: That’s why there’s no cats in my neighborhood.

Steven Julian: Jody, they just both went there. Two different ways, two different statements, but, you know, behind every great genius, there’s a dark side. And Noah wanted to start a podcast about that. Remember last time we were recording, there’s a true crime product design podcast.

Brock Kolls: You have to do customer discovery.

Steven Julian: Oh, man. Well, Cat Slippers is going in the reference box right next to Frank’s Cheese Hammers and other things. You have a question.

Noah: So we sort of talked around this a little bit. We mentioned how this is much more efficient and et cetera. But one of the things that amazes me about it that we talked about earlier is the cost. How much does this cost?

Steven: Oh, look at him going right to it.

Noah: How much does this cost? an inventor? Yeah.

Brock Kolls: So to me, this is super win, right? Because at the end of the day, I always introduce myself as an inventor, even though I’m the patent guy and everything. So I would typically charge $500 to do a provisional plus the filing fees. And that can vary a little bit on there. I figured I would set the bar at $300 for this automated provisional on there and offer people a discount. And so anybody who listens to the podcast can go and put in the word jumpstart, J-U-M-P-S-T-A-R-T, one word, and it’ll give you a 50% discount. It ends up making the provisional $149. And I just think that’s magic. The value creation is unbelievable. People typically come to my website. I’ll do some sort of call with them. There’s even a podcast. On the page, on my website, they can listen to on the process in order to put this in.

Steven: Well, there better be another one in the coming months.

Brock Kolls: There is. There is on the main page. I do have the one.

Noah: He’s got one of our old episodes up there.

Brock Kolls: I do. I do.

Steven: Of course you do. Of course you. do. I do. So the website, just so that everybody knows, it is great, but it’s GR, the number eight, numeral eight, the snowman. Okay. GR. Numeral eight, bigideas.com. And then right on there, you can find. Exactly.

Brock Kolls: It’s called Fast Provisional.

Steven: Fast Provisional.

Brock Kolls: You can click right on there. And then, you know, like I say, follow the steps, use the discount code. My calendar’s on there as well, if you’d like to talk. It’s fantastic.

Steven: Now the landscape report, that’s a separate.

Brock Kolls: Yeah, it’s on there too.

Steven: Okay, and that’s a separate cost. But again

Steven Julian: Greetings and salutations. Steven Julian: I am your slightly annoying host, Steven Julian. Steven Julian: Welcome to a new edition of Product Genius. Steven Julian: This time… Without Tiffany Crumans, but what we do have is the fantastic Noah McNeely. Steven Julian: Noah, welcome back to the show. Noah McNeely: Yeah, it’s good to be back. Noah McNeely: I feel like it’s been an entire pandemic ago. Steven Julian: Almost. Steven Julian: It’s been at least, it’s been a year, but it does kind of feel like a whole pandemic ago. Steven Julian: So, Product Genius, this might sound a little bit different. Steven Julian: There are some differences. Steven Julian: Why don’t? Steven Julian: we cover all that stuff up front?

Steven Julian: Broadcasting this show almost live from the Plush Palatial Studios that is the worldwide headquarters of Product Quick Start. Steven Julian: Tell everybody about your new digs. Noah McNeely: Yes, so Product Quick Start, we were fortunate enough to move into a new facility, well, new to us facility that we’re renovating in what they call the Depot District of Lawrenceville, Georgia, which is this… Exciting little area where we have some breweries and we have a distillery going in. Noah McNeely: that I think is going to make tequila and I try to remain sober during the day when I’m working here. Steven Julian: Especially when you’re doing the show. Steven Julian: Well, maybe not as much when you do that. Noah McNeely: Probably more important that I remain sober when using the power equipment in the back. Steven Julian: Amen. Steven Julian: The other thing we want to talk about for those people who are coming upon this episode and have listened to past episodes. Steven Julian: In some respects, we’re the same, but in some respects, there are some differences. Steven Julian: This show was always known as Product Genius with Tiffany Krumans. Steven Julian: Tiffany is still with us, but she’s not with us in the studio. Steven Julian: So, Noah, I ask. Steven Julian: you, where in the world is Tiffany Krumans? Noah McNeely: Well, anyone that has listened to more recent shows probably knows Tiffany has a lot of ideas for businesses, and she also has… New children in her life, and she stays very, very busy. Noah McNeely: Her latest company is called Opu Probiotics, and it’s a fabulous product. Noah McNeely: I recommend you try it. Noah McNeely: I particularly like the mocha mint flavor. Noah McNeely: But anyway, we believe that Tiffany is scouring the world looking for the finest ingredients she can for that particular product. Noah McNeely: So you might find her in the Himalayas or the Amazon. Noah McNeely: Probably wearing a baby and a baby Bjorn and with three other kids following her around. Steven Julian: And everybody can go to opuprobiotics.com, opuprobiotics.com, and see all the latest things that Tiffany is doing with that product. Steven Julian: And therefore, she was the creator of Product Genius originally, and you were a fantastic partner and sponsor of the show and would come on and talk about… Developing products through your business, productquickstart.com. Steven Julian: And when Tiffany really launched Opu, she told all of us, Jody Smith, the producer of the show, and myself as the slightly annoying host, hey, I’m going to take a little. Steven Julian: bit of time off. Steven Julian: I got to launch this new business. Steven Julian: And then in the meantime, let me just fast forward a little bit. Steven Julian: And I don’t know how much behind the scenes and unplugged you want to get. Steven Julian: Why are you sitting across the table from me and why are you now kind of leading this ship that Tiffany built up to this point? Noah McNeely: Well, first, we’re going to hope that the Shipley is led in a good direction and not running aground. Steven Julian: Not yet, at least. Steven Julian: We’re five minutes in. Steven Julian: It’s so far so good. Noah McNeely: So, yeah, we’re doing great at the moment. Noah McNeely: Well, I always enjoyed doing the show. Noah McNeely: I mean, I had a lot of fun with you guys and it really hits one of my passions, which… I like talking about this stuff. Noah McNeely: I do what I love. Noah McNeely: I enjoy explaining it to people. Noah McNeely: I think the show is a good way to do that. Noah McNeely: I’ve actually met a number of people through the show. Noah McNeely: Those are all great conversations. Noah McNeely: My hope is as we move forward, Product Genius will be a show that’s useful for inventors, of course. Noah McNeely: Really, I think we’re going to. Noah McNeely: talk about things that relate to all entrepreneurs or most entrepreneurs. Noah McNeely: Even to people that work for bigger companies that want to think more like entrepreneurs. Steven Julian: So here we are after more than a year off. Steven Julian: We’re doing a new show. Steven Julian: Noah McNeely is sitting across the table from me. Steven Julian: Jody Smith from JodySmith.com is still our producer. Steven Julian: I’m still the slightly annoying host. Steven Julian: And here we are still talking about product development. Steven Julian: We’re going to talk about inventing. Steven Julian: And today we’re talking about help. Steven Julian: I’ve got too many ideas. Steven Julian: Which is definitely true of this show after not doing it for a year. Steven Julian: And people who are doing product development and kind of trying to bring their product to market, as they’re bringing one product to market, they have all these other ideas. Steven Julian: That’s the entrepreneurial, that’s the inventor. Steven Julian: There’s a lot of people listening who, number one, are going, okay, yeah, they’re talking about something I need to talk about. Steven Julian: And when you’re listening to this, you might also be thinking, Ooh, I know someone else that needs to hear this. Steven Julian: So listen to this one, invite them to hear the show because we’re going to be talking. Steven Julian: about, I got too many ideas. Steven Julian: So the title of the show, obviously I gave a little bit of a inkling of it.

Steven Julian: You are guilty of this just like anybody else, right? Noah McNeely: Oh, absolutely. Noah McNeely: In fact, the fact that I’m doing this podcast while writing a business and… Engaging in various other hobbies may be an example of where I’m guilty of this, but I’m trying to balance it well. Noah McNeely: And we thought this would be a really good topic for the first show because Tiffany is actually a great example of doing this well. Noah McNeely: She realized at some point that she had too many different things going on. Noah McNeely: So to be successful, she had to push some of them to the back, and that’s why. Noah McNeely: That’s why we’re here. Steven Julian: That’s why she’s out finding those great products or finding those great ingredients to go into the mint mocha. Noah McNeely: That’s why she’s in the Amazon today. Noah McNeely: Exactly. Noah McNeely: So, you know, this is a problem that doesn’t just affect inventors and entrepreneurs. Noah McNeely: It actually affects big companies as well. Noah McNeely: And back when I did a lot of big company work, this was a topic that would come up. Noah McNeely: The big. Noah McNeely: scary corporate name for this is portfolio management. Noah McNeely: As an inventor entrepreneur, you never need to use that phrase again, probably. Noah McNeely: But the idea is even big companies, they have so many things that they want to do or would love to do, but they can’t do them all. Noah McNeely: In a big company, like a Fortune 500 company, I almost said some names there, but I don’t want to be sued or anything by any of my clients from years ago. Noah McNeely: In a big company, you have entire teams of people in many cases. Noah McNeely: Their whole job is to manage and really to do the portfolio management role. Noah McNeely: They’ll have roadmaps of products that the company is going to develop for five, ten years out in some cases, and they have to prioritize those. Steven Julian: So let’s talk about the person who’s listening to this podcast who’s trying to bring one or a couple of products to market or are trying to build their business. Steven Julian: Go from idea to prototype to development.

Steven Julian: When you say, help, I’ve got too many ideas, can that be true of one product? Noah McNeely: It can be. Noah McNeely: It can be true of one product or it can. Noah McNeely: also just be the nature of the individual. Noah McNeely: So I’ve met people that clients have come in and they get really excited about their product. Noah McNeely: We go through that. Noah McNeely: And then a lot of times on the way out the door, they’re like, and this is just the tip of the iceberg. Noah McNeely: I’ve got seven more I’m working on. Noah McNeely: We’re going to talk about them next time. Noah McNeely: And I think they tell me that to get me more excited about working with them, but that’s really often a red flag. Noah McNeely: So on the next meeting, you’re at the next meeting, I usually have to tamp that down a little bit and say, you know, look, that’s great. Noah McNeely: I love all these ideas, but let’s get one on the market first. Noah McNeely: And I think that can be a tough thing for entrepreneurs, even myself, because I have… I have so many things I want to accomplish and want to do, but it’s easy to want to spend all the time in the visionary stage. Noah McNeely: Hey, this is going to be fun. Noah McNeely: I’m going to spend all day thinking about this idea and jotting out what’s it going to be like when. Noah McNeely: I’m done. Noah McNeely: But the problem is there’s a lot of things that have to happen between now and achieving that vision. Steven Julian: And the ideas is the sexy part. Steven Julian: The ideas is the everybody’s. Steven Julian: Had at least one or two ideas. Steven Julian: I actually, I still don’t know why at times I’m the slightly annoying host of the show because I’ve had very few ideas of products. Steven Julian: I’ve never tried to develop anything, but I would relate it. Steven Julian: I, I love the world of comedy and I love listening to comedians, especially them talking about doing jokes. Steven Julian: And it’s one thing to have, Hey, Seinfeld had a book called, is this anything you start with an idea? Steven Julian: Hey, is this anything? Steven Julian: Is this potentially funny? Steven Julian: But from that point to getting it to where it’s a tight bit to be done on stage, there’s this huge, there’s a lot of work that goes in. Steven Julian: So you just mentioned it’s easy to do the ideas. Steven Julian: I got seven more, but they got all this work they got to do to just to get that one. Steven Julian: But I want to drill down and I want to kind of push back and ask even that. Steven Julian: person who’s on that one, I’ve got too many ideas. Steven Julian: Do they get sidetracked with too many things even in that one single idea? Steven Julian: That they’re bringing to market? Noah McNeely: Yeah, that can happen too.

Noah McNeely: I think we may have talked about this a long time ago, but there’s a concept I call minimum viable product or early viable product. Steven Julian: I remember that. Noah McNeely: Yes, it’s a classic. Noah McNeely: You should check it out. Noah McNeely: But the issue there is sometimes maybe it is just one product, but they have all these ideas for that one product. Noah McNeely: Oh, I want it to do this. Noah McNeely: I want it to do that. Noah McNeely: I want it to be Wi-Fi and I want it to levitate and I want it to glow in the dark. Noah McNeely: Sir, it’s a doorknob. Noah McNeely: It doesn’t need to necessarily do all that. Noah McNeely: Those are all great. Noah McNeely: Let’s get one on the market. Noah McNeely: because all that stuff you just talked about, that’s a two-year development program. Noah McNeely: If we just do your basic product, which is already cool and already different than anything out there, you can be on the market in six months. Noah McNeely: You can generate revenue. Noah McNeely: You’ve got a successful business at that. Noah McNeely: point. Noah McNeely: And more importantly, you’ve got money that you can now spend on Gen 2 and Gen 3 and Gen 4. Noah McNeely: But if we start down the path of developing, The super mega colossal product now, you’re never going to get there. Steven Julian: And we titled this show again, Help, but I think probably more often than not your job as the product development guru, as the genius who helps people bring their product to market, you have to tell them you really should be saying, Help, I have too many ideas in this super amazing, stupendous product. Steven Julian: Very rarely do they verbalize that. Steven Julian: You’re helping them verbalize. Noah McNeely: Right. Noah McNeely: Well, sometimes I have to help people realize it is a problem because, like I said, a lot of visionary people and a lot of entrepreneurs, like myself, we do tend to love that visionary phase. Noah McNeely: And we think that’s the most important thing. Noah McNeely: It’s not. Noah McNeely: It’s actually one of the least important and easiest parts of having a successful business.

Noah McNeely: So think about it this way. Noah McNeely: Think about all the little boys who dream about winning a Super Bowl as the quarterback. Noah McNeely: Now, you can’t just keep dreaming about winning a. Super Bowl. Noah McNeely: That’s great. Noah McNeely: That’s a wonderful vision. Noah McNeely: But if you don’t start exercising and training and learning the game, you’ll never play on a team, much less get to the Super Bowl. Steven Julian: So it’s a difference between being a Super Bowl quarterback and being Uncle Rico sitting on the front step saying, if Coach had put me in that game, we would have won the state that year. Noah McNeely: That’s exactly right. Noah McNeely: And there are no time machines that will get you back there. Steven Julian: Exactly. Steven Julian: So portfolio management, to use the term of the Fortune 500 companies, is really them kind of categorizing or siloing or insert other corporate term here. Steven Julian: But really, it’s checking boxes. Steven Julian: It’s laying it out in steps.

Steven Julian: Is that something that you, as the person with Product Quick Start, is trying to help people say, okay, here are the 17 steps that we’re going to have to take? Steven Julian: Or is it just getting them focused on creating the 17 steps? Steven Julian: Kind of talk through that process. Steven Julian: Someone’s got an idea, and then someone starts to spiral into too many ideas. Steven Julian: The portfolio management that you do, not for the Fortune 500, but for the individual. Steven Julian: entrepreneur and inventor, what do you try to bring to the table? Noah McNeely: Yeah, so it’s really launch your product in 375 easy steps. Noah McNeely: No, it’s not. Noah McNeely: There’s really only two questions. Steven Julian: I thought it was 367 steps. Noah McNeely: We revised it last year. Noah McNeely: Oh, okay. Noah McNeely: So there’s really only two. Noah McNeely: Two questions that I ask people to consider when they’re trying to prioritize the features of their product or which product to develop or which product to develop when. Noah McNeely: And with the assumption that inventor entrepreneurs, you probably don’t have five people or 20 people on a team that you’re paying to do all the analysis. Noah McNeely: And yeah, you go to a really big company and they’re going to ask a lot more than these two questions. Noah McNeely: At least they’re going to ask a lot more versions of these two questions. Noah McNeely: But the two questions I tell people to consider is, number one, what can I get to the market with my resources? Noah McNeely: And of course, I can help them try to figure that out. Noah McNeely: This is how much it’s going to take to develop this product, to make the tooling for it, to produce it. Noah McNeely: So we have to be. Noah McNeely: realistic about what resources you have to actually get that to the market. Noah McNeely: And that may mean you can’t launch five at a time. Noah McNeely: Now, I’ve had some clients that are just independently wealthy, and yeah, they can do it. Noah McNeely: They have the resources for that. Noah McNeely: It can still be a bad idea in those cases because a resource that people often overlook is their own time, their own focus, their own ability to strategize and think about their business. Noah McNeely: So the second question is, what can I sell? Noah McNeely: You know, what will I be able to sell? Noah McNeely: So, yeah, this is a great idea. Noah McNeely: I have the funds to develop it. Noah McNeely: I have the resources to develop it. Noah McNeely: But is there a market for it? Noah McNeely: And is it a market that I understand well enough to actually sell? Noah McNeely: And the answer to either of those questions is no. Noah McNeely: Then that’s probably not the product you should develop first. Noah McNeely: You need to focus on the product or the collection of features in your product. Noah McNeely: that both of those answers are yes. Steven Julian: And I know we’ve talked about variations of those questions over past episodes. Steven Julian: Encourage everybody to go back and. Steven Julian: listen to Noah’s past episodes on Product Genius. Noah McNeely: Product Genius is brought to you by Opu Probiotics. Noah McNeely: Pre and probiotics you can pour directly on your tongue in delicious mint and mocha flavors. Steven Julian: But the taste is just the beginning. Noah McNeely: With Opu, you can see improved digestive function, boosted immune system, easier weight management, improved mental health, and much more. Noah McNeely: Try today at GetOpu.com. Steven Julian: That’s GetOpu.com. Steven Julian: Let me focus in on the second question. Steven Julian: first, because I think… The typical inventor entrepreneur who sits down with you, especially with their first idea, and you ask them that question, you know, what can I sell? Steven Julian: Can this sell? Steven Julian: Their answer, bar none, is going to be, well, of course this is going to sell. Steven Julian: It’s a fantastic idea. Steven Julian: I came up with this. Steven Julian: It came in a bolt of lightning. Steven Julian: Everybody who brings you any idea is going to tell you, well, of course it’s going to sell. Steven Julian: It’s fantastic. Noah McNeely: Yeah, I’ve heard variations of, well, why wouldn’t you buy this if you could buy it? Noah McNeely: I’ve probably heard a hundred variations of that throughout the course of my career.

Steven Julian: You’re a communist pig if you don’t buy this, of course. Steven Julian: This is great. Steven Julian: Sorry, that was my insertion, not Noah’s. Steven Julian: My apologies. Noah McNeely: Yeah, so we’re going to remain politically apolitical here as best we can. Noah McNeely: Uh, yeah. Noah McNeely: So a lot of, um, a lot of inventor entrepreneurs, they’re so enamored by their idea. Noah McNeely: They just can’t imagine it not being successful. Noah McNeely: And then they’re like, well, as soon as people see this, they’re going to want it. Noah McNeely: That may be true. Noah McNeely: And that, that in some ways that for most people, that probably is true. Noah McNeely: The question becomes, how do you reach those people? Noah McNeely: And that’s also part of how do you sell it? Noah McNeely: Can you sell it? Noah McNeely: Uh, so if you’ve got a, it’s a product that, oh, everyone would use it. Noah McNeely: Well, that’s almost the worst kind of product for an inventor because. Noah McNeely: You don’t have the marketing budget to reach everybody. Noah McNeely: If it’s more focused, like, well, people that have teenage girls that want to learn how to play golf, you can reach that market a lot easier and in a more forceful way. Noah McNeely: So that’s also part of, you know, what’s it going to take to sell this? Noah McNeely: Not necessarily even, do I have the sales? Noah McNeely: skills? Noah McNeely: You can always hire someone to do that for you, but it’s got to be. Noah McNeely: Do I have the resources not only to design, develop, produce this product, but do I have the resources to sell it? Noah McNeely: What are those resources going to be? Steven Julian: And in your help in answering that question, because I was kind of pushing back against the question, the second question you asked there, what can I sell? Steven Julian: You have to drill down and you have to ask that question more specifically or they have to answer that question more specifically because really what you’re asking is, is there a market for this? Steven Julian: Can the person define the market? Steven Julian: Can you sell it? Steven Julian: Meaning the person who’s got the idea, how would you sell it? Steven Julian: So let me then ask this in helping them answer that question. Steven Julian: How much is it you trying to get them to have their eyes open to all the all that that’s going to entail of selling the product? Steven Julian: or and or how much is it you saying, if you’ll listen to me, I’ve had a lot of experience and I’ve done this for a long time and I’ve done. Steven Julian: this. Steven Julian: On corporate level and individual level, here’s what I believe and I know surrounding what you’ve just told me about this idea. Noah McNeely: It’s a little bit of both. Noah McNeely: It depends on who I’m talking to and how receptive they are. Steven Julian: Ah, there we go. Noah McNeely: Different people with different personalities. Noah McNeely: You know, it’s kind of like the old Aesop’s fables, the way he would teach very powerful people lessons without insulting them, as he would tell a story about someone else who was fictional. Noah McNeely: They would maybe learn a lesson about. Noah McNeely: So sometimes I have to do that. Noah McNeely: And it comes along as, you know, I have to say, you know, look, I’m not into sales. Noah McNeely: I’m not into marketing. Noah McNeely: I design, build, and create stuff. Noah McNeely: I can help you fill a warehouse full of product. Noah McNeely: That’s no problem. Noah McNeely: We got that. Noah McNeely: What I can’t help you do is I can’t help you sell. Noah McNeely: I can’t help you market. Noah McNeely: I can tell you what I’ve seen other people do and what that’s cost them. Noah McNeely: And oftentimes that loan and going through that process is enough to help them realize, oh, I hadn’t thought about that. Noah McNeely: I hadn’t thought about that. Noah McNeely: I am going to need a budget for that. Noah McNeely: And so sometimes I approach it that way. Noah McNeely: Sometimes people come in and they do have a lot of really good business savvy, business knowledge, business experience. Noah McNeely: They understand that right up front. Noah McNeely: I have to do a lot less in those cases. Noah McNeely: Sometimes in those cases, it’s more about explaining why it costs so much to make this product or that product or whatever it is. Steven Julian: So let me just ask Noah McNeely, the Product Quick Start CEO and the guy who’s done this for more than a few years, although you only look like you’ve been doing it for a few years. Noah McNeely: Well, hair dye goes a long way. Steven Julian: Exactly. Steven Julian: And flattery will get me everywhere. Steven Julian: Do you enjoy to an extent when someone who’s just starting out in this, it’s their first idea, they’ve never run a business, but they’re receptive to your kind of expertise and guidance. Steven Julian: There’s that that’s satisfying. Steven Julian: As well as the satisfying of kind of someone with some business savvy who knows the business stuff and you don’t have to spend as much time on that and you can really just focus on. Steven Julian: the product development. Steven Julian: Is there a preference one where this is just a personal question I’m asking at this point? Noah McNeely: That is a very difficult question. Noah McNeely: Exactly. Steven Julian: I’m slightly annoyed. Noah McNeely: It’s very individual based. Steven Julian: This is a relational thing for you, right? Steven Julian: This is a relational business, even for you and this. Noah McNeely: I’ll put you this way. Noah McNeely: I’m at a point in my career, I’ve done this long enough, I don’t usually have to work with people I dislike. Noah McNeely: Now, I will do my best to help anyone. Noah McNeely: Even if I dislike you, I will try to point you in a good direction, sometimes to someone I don’t like, but also. Noah McNeely: They don’t know that. Noah McNeely: Yeah, they don’t know that. Noah McNeely: No, but either can be good. Noah McNeely: I think it’s better for me to answer this from the standpoint of what’s the worst type of relationship. Steven Julian: Oh, there we go. Noah McNeely: That’s where someone comes in and they’ve never developed a product before. Noah McNeely: They don’t know anything about it, but they saw something on TV. Noah McNeely: So now they’re an expert or they stayed at a Holiday Inn Express last night. Noah McNeely: So now they’re an expert and they come in and they’re like, this is how you’re going to do it. Noah McNeely: This is how you’re going to do it. Noah McNeely: And I’m like, well, why are you here? Noah McNeely: How am I supposed to help you? Noah McNeely: You know everything already. Noah McNeely: Even though everything you just told me is completely wrong. Noah McNeely: I know you’ve read a book about it that some idiot wrote who doesn’t know what he’s talking about, but that’s not how you do it. Noah McNeely: That’s not how the real world works. Noah McNeely: So those are not good relationships. Noah McNeely: Those usually end quickly. Noah McNeely: The other side of that is people that they just cannot accept what I’m telling them. Noah McNeely: So here’s the problem you have. Noah McNeely: And if you cannot solve this problem, You don’t have a business. Noah McNeely: Now, that’s just my opinion, but my opinion is based on a lot of experience, and some people just, they get really irritated about that, and I never hear from them again, and that’s probably for the best for me. Noah McNeely: But unfortunately, they then go out and they find an engineer who’s just happy to take their money, and they’ll spend a year. Noah McNeely: Dumping thousands of dollars into making something that they can never afford to produce or. Noah McNeely: that it’s never going to sell or it’s just the wrong market. Steven Julian: I like the way you answered that question. Steven Julian: Well done. Steven Julian: I asked a difficult question. Steven Julian: Noah gave a great answer to it. Steven Julian: So let me transition from the second question you asked of what can I sell. Steven Julian: And let’s kind of circle back real quick to that first question. Steven Julian: What can I get to the market with my resources? Steven Julian: This is a… Another way of kind of talking about minimum viable products. Steven Julian: So what do you need to know from the person that you’re talking to? Steven Julian: when it comes, because that word resources, let me unpack that just a little bit more. Steven Julian: You know, what can I get to the market with my resources? Steven Julian: You kind of need to know some things. Steven Julian: How much money do you have? Steven Julian: How much time do you have? Steven Julian: Kind of break that down. Noah McNeely: Yeah, I need them to be honest with themselves and with me.

Noah McNeely: Stuff costs what it costs. Noah McNeely: You know, I can’t work for free. Noah McNeely: Most people cannot. Noah McNeely: It doesn’t do you or me any good for you to come in and wear a fancy suit, pretend like you have. Noah McNeely: all this money, and then you don’t. Noah McNeely: Because then you and I are going to talk and go, hey, this is generally what this is going to cost. Noah McNeely: And you’re going to get one or two steps into that and say, oh, I can’t afford to go any further. Noah McNeely: Well, it’s like, well, why did you waste the money on the first two steps? Noah McNeely: I told you what it was going to cost to get this far. Noah McNeely: It’s like, I don’t know. Noah McNeely: Well. Noah McNeely: I can’t refund your money. Noah McNeely: All the work is done. Noah McNeely: The prototypes are built. Noah McNeely: Whatever it is, that’s done. Noah McNeely: I’m sorry you can’t take it any further, but I don’t know what you want me to do. Noah McNeely: Go out and raise some money and come back in a few years, I guess. Noah McNeely: So that’s kind of the worst scenario there. Noah McNeely: I think I do need to do my best to explain to them, and I try my very best to this where I can. Noah McNeely: This is generally what it’s going to take. Noah McNeely: Hear what they’re trying to do. Noah McNeely: I’ll lay out a scope. Noah McNeely: Okay, the first phase is to get us to a prototype. Noah McNeely: I can give. Noah McNeely: that a pretty tight number. Noah McNeely: If there’s stuff in there, I don’t know. Noah McNeely: Yeah, I don’t know. Noah McNeely: Are we going to end up in this material or that material? Noah McNeely: Beyond that, I have to give an estimated range. Noah McNeely: And then I can give my best guess at what the manufacturing is going to cost. Noah McNeely: But I can’t, you know, obviously on day one, nothing’s been designed. Noah McNeely: So I don’t know exactly what that is going to cost at the back end. Noah McNeely: So I do my best to open their eyes to what the costs are going to be. Noah McNeely: And also a little bit, you know, you’re going to have to have money for marketing. Noah McNeely: If you’re going to do a patent, I’ll send them to Brock, who you may know from other shows. Noah McNeely: All that’s going to take money. Noah McNeely: You may have to prioritize what you want to spend your money on and how you want to spend it. Noah McNeely: And I think actually in our next episode, we have some ideas about that. Steven Julian: Ooh, fellow with a tease. Noah McNeely: A slight tease, yes. Noah McNeely: I like that. Steven Julian: Well done. Noah McNeely: I am not a radio professional. Steven Julian: You just played one on this podcast. Steven Julian: So let me just, again, push back slightly on the word resources. Steven Julian: So we are talking about money. Steven Julian: There’s no question. Steven Julian: that is the main. Noah McNeely: Not just money. Steven Julian: Well, that was my question. Steven Julian: Don’t take my question away from me. Steven Julian: You definitely are not a professional when you did that. Noah McNeely: Clearly not. Steven Julian: So apart from money, what other resources can people bring to the table that you need to know about that will help you in helping them develop their products? Steven Julian: See how I did that? Steven Julian: Was that good? Steven Julian: All right. Noah McNeely: Thank you. Noah McNeely: So you may have other resources in terms of people in your network. Noah McNeely: You know, if you come in and say, I have this great idea and it’s for, you know, baseball players and blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. Noah McNeely: And okay, that’s great. Noah McNeely: But you don’t tell me, oh, and by the way, my cousin plays Major League Baseball. Noah McNeely: Well, you know, that’s a resource that we could know about. Noah McNeely: that can actually change my mind about how you would market this. Noah McNeely: Oh, well, maybe you don’t need all this money for marketing because your cousin can endorse it. Noah McNeely: Well, that may change what I advise you. Noah McNeely: on. Noah McNeely: